Subject: Re: New Topic Please! Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 15:15:08 -0400 From: "Dave B." Organization: Joe's Novelty Shop Newsgroups: startext.jfk Ok, I'll bite. I'm sure that many of you have seen this document along with Roy Payne's. I've never been able to find any document that explains *why* the FBI decided to visit Payne and Hathcock the day after Kennedy was killed. Did they find this rifle? Where? From what I can piece together, Hall, Howard and Celio Castro Alba left Clint Wheat's house with guns and medical supplies, stopped at Hathcock's, picked up Hemming's rifle with a check they got from Dr Jose Norman, drove to Dallas and left the trailor of weapons with oilman Lester Logue. Supposedly Hall and William Seymour came back to Dallas, got arrested, questioned by the Dallas PD, FBI and military intelligence. Hall called Dr. Robert Morris to get released from jail. Morris called Logue who then called an attorney to get them released. DOC #003267 AFFIDAVIT OF RICHARD HATHCOCK My name is Richard Hathcock. I once owned and operated Allied International Detective Agency. At the time that we're interest in, my offices were at Hollywood Boulevard in the Outpost Building. About two months before the John Kennedy assassination in Dallas, two men came to see me in my office One was Jerry Patrick Hemming, who was using the name of Jerry Patrick. other man was Lorenzo Hall, who like to called Skip Hall, whose real name was Pacillio, which I understand is a Cuban name. These men came to see me afternoon, stating that they had heard of me because of my many years of undercover investigation of communism on the state college campuses here I worked for the Hearst chain, and some other activities, anti-communist activities that I had been involved in. They were here, they told me, to raise money with which to buy medicines and equipment, military hardware a planned invasion of Cuba. That they were going to train troops in Guatemala, which they actually did later. They told me that they were dead broke, and that they were going to be here for two or three weeks, they had some other contacts that they wanted to see, raise money, but meantime they needed a hundred dollars. They wanted to borrow the hundred dollars, and what they had for security was a set of golf clubs and a rifle which was a .30 caliber Johnson, modified to sem-automatic operation, which I believe held nine rounds, and also was equipped with a 30 power Bushnell variable scope. I gave them the hundred dollars, they left the golf clubs and the rifle. For several weeks after that, I saw both men frequently, then my understanding was that Jerry Patrick returned to Miami to set things in operation down there for the planned invasion of Cuba. What they had planned essentially was to blow up some oil storage tanks on the west coast. Loran Hall stayed here, and was in the private eye office very often, almost every day. He told me that both he and Patrick had originally been in Castro's army when they believed that he was really trying to free Cuba from Batista that they had fought, fought hard, helped to put Castro in power, found out that he was a communist, had no interest in the poeple, and they turned on Castro with the result that both were imprisoned, and sentenced to be shot. Both, through manipulations and through friends managed to escape and get out this country. They showed me lots of photos, gave me documents, and I do believe what they told me about those things. Eventually, as I say, Pat went back to Miami, and I did not see him after that. Shortly before the assassination, if memory serves me correctly, it was no more that ten days before the assassination, Skip Hall and a big, fat Mexican whom I'd never seen before, and whose name I don't recall at this time, but I'm sure the FBI it, came to see me, told me that they were going to Dallas to pick up some medicines and some other material, they wanted to redeem the rifle. They gave me $50, told me to keep the golf clubs, I got a note signed by Skip Hall that he had picked up the rifle, which I later gave to Jerry Crow, of the FBI. What happened to that rifle, I don't know. Jim Garrison showed me a photo at one time, an 8X10 enlargement, which he said was made by a Dallas Morning News photographer seconds after the killing in Dallas. The photo showed a Dallas detective holding the rifle which was picked up on Dealey Plaza. The rifle looked to me exactly like the one I'd had in my office. I have combed the Warren report stem to stern. I find no mention of that one which was picked up on Dealey Plaza. I also found no mention of another rifle found on the second floor of the book depository building. Skip Hall later told me that he had turned that rifle over a doctor friend of his Miami, Florida. Jerry Patrick told me later that that was a damn lie, that he talked to Hall, and as far as he could find out that was a lie about the rifle was. But he told me that he had never recovered the rifle. The rifle was in my office all those weeks, and one of the gentlemen who worked with me in the detective business, Roy Payne, who is a gun expert and a gun nut, assembeled and disassembled and reassembled that rifle on numerous occasions. And I'm sure that Mr Payne can tell you a great deal more about the rifle than I can.. The day after John Kennedy was killed in Dallas, received a phone call from Jerry Crow, an FBI agent here in Los Angeles, asked if I had an agent working for me who was named Pay Payne, and I said yes. Jerry wanted to know if he could come by the office and see me and Payne, and we arranged for that meeting. It's my opinion that the reason he wanted to see Mr Payne was because Payne's fingerprints undoubtly were all over that rifle from his having handled it many times. It's also my opinion that, unless that particular rifle had been found or in some way involved this whole thing, that the FBI would have no interest init. And I think we'd better let Mr Payne pick it up from here. Declare under penalty of perjury that the above three-page affidavit true correct to the best of my belief and knowledge. Signed - Richard Hatcock State of California County of Los Angeles