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From: schuck@fraser.sfu.ca (Bruce Jonathan Schuck)
Subject: Re: Oswald/Lovelady controversy
Message-ID: <schuck.724181753@sfu.ca>
Keywords: Altgen photograph 
Sender: news@sfu.ca
Reply-To: Bruce_Schuck@sfu.ca
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
References: <1992Dec10.134442.28469@engage.pko.dec.com> <1992Dec12.063951.21159@u.washington.edu>
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1992 17:35:53 GMT
Lines: 51

twarner@hardy.u.washington.edu (Tom Warner) writes:

>busta@vicki.enet.dec.com writes:

>>  If you blow up this photograph, specifically the section showing Oswald/
>> Lovelady and take note of the shirt being worn by this person, you'll notice
>> that it is a rather dark, long sleeved shirt unbuttoned down to approximately
>> mid-chest and the person wearing it has a white t-shirt on underneath.

>>  Next, get a copy of Oswalds' DPD mug shot from early after he was arrested
>> and you'll notice that Oswalds' shirt in this picture is IDENTICAL.

>What book has a good copy of the Altgens photo?

Whitewash by Weisberg. My university library has a copy, maybe yours
does too?

Check out the open window under the fire escape on the right side of
the picture -- the part that is usually cropped out in the WC etc.

Thats on the Dal-Tex building.

It's a perfect sniping position.

It`s low, it's directly behind the President, no target movement from
left to right.

In Menningers "Mortal Error", Howard Donahue claims the fatal head
shot came from down low and from behind JFK. The line he drew goes
over top of the SS car, which is partly why he claims it was an
accidental shooting from an SS AR-15. However, if the line is
continued, it goes to the Dal-Tex, very close to this open window.

Mortal Error also has the Altgens photo, uncropped I think.
I just picked up the paperback edition, and it's there but small.
However, there are some good full page color stills from the Z film
covering the fatal head shot and other important frames that weren't
in the original hardcover or at least not in color.

The print of frame 183 clearly shows all the SS agents looking forward
or to the right. None of them has turned around at all at 183, unlike
in the Altgens photo which shows three of them turned completely around
plus one of the right side motorcycle officers turned to look behind
him.

Despite what Todd and Grant keep claiming, none of the SS agents or
cops had heard a shot before 183.


>I wonder if it's still possible to buy a print from the AP.

 
 
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From: schuck@fraser.sfu.ca (Bruce Jonathan Schuck)
Subject: Re: Route of JFK's Limo
Message-ID: <schuck.724316066@sfu.ca>
Sender: news@sfu.ca
Reply-To: Bruce_Schuck@sfu.ca
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
References: <18446@mindlink.bc.ca>
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 06:54:26 GMT
Lines: 28

Mike_Quigley@mindlink.bc.ca (Mike Quigley) writes:

>Does anyone know the exact route that JFK's limo was to take from Love Field
>to the Convention Center? Would appreciate it if you could post this, or
>direct me to somewhere which has this info.

"The Death of a President" by William Manchester has a route map,
as well as the map of the funeral and the layout of Parkland and Air
Force One.

The map shows:

Love Field
left on Mockingbird Lane
right on Lemmon Avenue
right on Turtle Creek Blvd.
left on Cedar Springs Rd.
left on Harwood Street
right on Main Street
right on Houston
left on Elm
right on Stemmons Freeway

[unmarked turns]

onto Happy Hines Blvd
past Trade Mart to Parkland Memorial Hospital [unplanned]

 
 
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From: wix@eskimo.com (Dennis Wicks)
Subject: Re: LHO MYSTERY ID
Message-ID: <1992Dec14.015032.17644@eskimo.com>
Organization: >>> Eskimo North (206)-FOR-EVER <<<
References: <009648BE.FB3F1580@vms.csd.mu.edu> <1992Dec7.015050.8875@eskimo.com> <00964CB5.550B64C0@vms.csd.mu.edu>
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 01:50:32 GMT
Lines: 72

In article <00964CB5.550B64C0@vms.csd.mu.edu> 6489mcadamsj@vms.csd.mu.edu writes:
>In article <1992Dec7.015050.8875@eskimo.com>, wix@eskimo.com (Dennis Wicks) writes:
>
>>How about this:  If Oswald were allowed to remain free, he would
>>be a liability forever.  Being "unstable" he might spill the
>>beans at anytime.  If he were captured, then they could get
>>"someone" eg. Jack Ruby, to silence him permenantly.
>
>OK, it served the interests of The Conspiracy to kill him.  Wouldn't it make
>more sense to help him get away, and then kill him out of public view?  Yes,
>people get killed in police custody, but it's usually much easier when there
>aren't a lot of officers with guns around, and much better for The Conspiracy
>that it be done without the whole world watching.
>
Please note that all this is speculation on my part, but also a
possible explanation for some of the things that happened.  If
Oswald were indeed a "patsy" and he was trying to escape, perhaps
he was doing something, going somewhere, other than what had been
arranged.  If this were the case, then the conspirators might
have felt that enlisting the aid of the Dallas PD to locate LHO
and pin him down would be preferable to losing him completely and
trying to find him before he let the cat out of the bag.
>
>Then there is the question of whether Oswald would "spill the beans" before
>they could kill him.  Would any conspiracy assume that they could kill him
>before he did, if he were in police custody?  In a case like this?
>
If Oswald did not suspect that the conspirators had anything to
do with his apprehension, he could have still been expecting to
be "rescued," even if he suspected that he may have been set up.
As for the conspiracy's assumptions, since they had just
successfully assasinated the President of the United States, they
might consider the infiltration of the Dallas PD merely childs
play.  That is if they had not already done so.
>
>>
>>I personally think he was a patsy.  He was recruited by somebody
>>to do something very different from what actually happened.  He
>>may have realized what was up when the bullets started flying,
>>and up til the time he was killed by Ruby may have been expecting
>>to be rescued at any minute.
>
>Then how did he happen to get planted at the School Book Depository?  Kennedy's
>actual route wasn't known until a couple of days before the assasination.  How
>did The Conspiracy know they needed someone working in that precise building? 
>Or are you saying that The Conspiracy arranged for Kennedy to drive by?
>
Again, speculation, but it is possible that LHO wasn't the only
person planted at various places around Dallas.  He just happened
to be the one they used.  In most cities there are only a few
"parade routes" because of problems with traffic control, public
access, emergency vehicle routes, and other considerations.  So
once the visit to Dallas was firm there were probably only a few
possibilities that had to be covered.  And, it is possible that
someone connected to the conspiracy could have influenced the
choice of routes so that the one used was one they had covered.

I have a few related questions.  I haven't seen them discussed
here recently, and if they were covered in the media at the time
I have forgotten them.

- Was it usual practice for prisoners to be transferred as LHO
was at the time of his murder?

- How did the press learn of the transfer?  Especially the time
of the transfer?

- More importantly, how did Jack Ruby learn about it?

- Why was security so lax that nearly everybody and their dog was
there to observe the transfer?

 
 
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From: busta@vicki.enet.dec.com
Subject: Re: Oswald/Lovelady controversy
Message-ID: <1992Dec14.131112.1999@engage.pko.dec.com>
Sender: newsdaemon@engage.pko.dec.com (USENET News Daemon)
Organization: Digital Equipment Corporation
References: <1992Dec10.134442.28469@engage.pko.dec.com> <schuck.724093503@sfu.ca> <11DEC199213294014@zeus.tamu.edu>
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1992 13:10:17 GMT
Lines: 34


In article <11DEC199213294014@zeus.tamu.edu>, ajs9462@zeus.tamu.edu (SIMON, ANTHONY JOE) writes...
>In article <schuck.724093503@sfu.ca>, Bruce_Schuck@sfu.ca writes...
> 
>>With all the photographs and film shot that day, isn't there a picture
>>of Lovelady around to compare?
> 
>Josiah Thompson covers the subject of Oswald and Lovelady pretty thoroughly
>towards the end of "Six Seconds in Dallas" and concludes that it is Lovelady.
>There are "mug shots" of Oswald and Lovelady as well as a blowup of the Altgens
>photo. In my opinion, these pictures coupled with witnesses who were on the
>steps with Lovelady show that the person in the picture is Lovelady.



  Then how do you explain the fact that Lovelady stated that he was wearing
 a short-sleeved red and white vertical striped shirt, even wore the shirt
 for FBI photos, and the Altgens photo clearly shows that whoever that
 person is was NOT wearing anything of the sort.......





> 
>Tony Simon
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Paul R. Busta	Busta@vicki.enet.dec.com                       Salem,N.H.  
		--or-- ...!decwrl!vicki.enet.dec.com!busta    603-894-3962
		--or-- busta%vicki.enet@decwrl.dec.com

         "One only sees what one observes, and one observes only 
              those things which are already in the mind."
 
 
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From: jad@Turing.ORG (John DiNardo)
Subject: Part 28, PACIFICA RADIO Investigates the Murder of President Kennedy
Message-ID: <1992Dec14.191408.8449@mont.cs.missouri.edu>
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Originator: rich@pencil.cs.missouri.edu
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        I made the following transcript from a tape recording 
        of a broadcast by Pacifica Radio Network station
               WBAI-FM (99.5)
               505 Eighth Ave., 19th Fl.
               New York, NY 10018       (212) 279-0707

*   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *
                        (continuation)
JIM MARRS:
And the local sheriff said that he knew both the son of the
patrolman and Sullivan, so he felt like he was too close to the
case. So he turned over the investigation of this particular
incident to the local game warden. I've seen a copy of the report,
and it's simply checked where it says:
    "Victim: Animal or Human."
They checked "Human". And that was about the extent of the
investigation.

GARY NULL:
Now, keep in mind that Sullivan was one of the former top heads
of the FBI. In fact, outside of Hoover, he was probably the second
most powerful member of the FBI.

JIM MARRS:
That's true.  And he has stated some things that are very
eye-opening. One of the reasons why he left the FBI is because he
said that Hoover was concentrating more on inflated statistics and
figures about the American Communist Party than he did on 
Organized Crime.

GARY NULL:
By the way, let's also remember this. It's up to the Public to
decide whether they feel that this is coincidence or not:
William Sullivan, Louis Nichols, Alan H. Belmont, James Caddigan,
J.N. English, and Donald Kaylor[sp] ALL understood what was going
on, or had information concerning the Kennedy Assassination.
ALL died under mysterious circumstances in 1977.

JIM MARRS:
That's true. All within a period of a few months, and all BEFORE
they could be [were about to be] brought to testify before the
House Select Committee on Assassinations.

GARY NULL:
And I think it stretches credulity to assume that all of these men
from one organization -- all of whom were going to testify --
would all die accidentally in the ways that they did: one man being
shot in his backyard in a suburban home; and the man who shot him
said he thought that [Sullivan] was a deer. I mean, come on.
Give us a break. Now the New York Times CERTAINLY would accept
that logic and rationale, and we understand how the New York Times
would accept that. And Dan Rather may accept that a man in his
backyard looks like a deer.  We don't!

   [JD: I've heard of a book (it might be "BETRAYAL") that states
    that Walter Cronkite and perhaps Dan Rather (I'm not sure) are
    among the people whom the CIA employs as journalistic "assets."
    Can anyone cite and quote such published accusations and their
    sources?]

And we're offended by this kind of explanation that has gone on,
and has NEVER been explored by the mass media in any major way. 
It's just been ACCEPTED that way.

Now, let's go to the case of Richard Case Nagle and the registered
letter to J. Edgar Hoover about the assassination.

JIM MARRS:
Yes. Richard Case Nagle may be the real Rosetta stone to
understanding the assassination or, if not to understanding the
assassination, certainly to understanding the role of Lee Harvey
Oswald in this whole thing.  Basically, Nagle was a decorated
Korean War veteran who late became an agent for the Central
Intelligence Agency, and eventually claimed to have ended up being
a double-agent working for the Soviet KGB. He said that in mid-1963,
his KGB superiors contacted him and said that they had become
aware of a plot to kill President Kennedy, and that they wanted
him to work his way in there, find out what was going on, and put
a stop to it because it could reflect very adversely on Russia and
could make it look like the Communists were behind the thing.  
And they didn't want to run that kind of risk.                   

So, he was sent to New Orleans where he made contact with a man
whom he claimed he had known from U.S. intelligence over in Japan.
And that was Lee Harvey Oswald!  They met in Jackson Square.
And, of course, here's Nagle posing as a KGB agent, so he can't
very well just say: "Hey, I'm really one of you,"  because he knows
that Oswald is a guy whom he had know in Japan, but he hadn't known
him that well. And besides, who knows what had gone on in the
intervening years? So I'm sure he was probably still trying to
maintain his cover. But he basically told Oswald that Oswald was
in a very dangerous situation, and that he thought that Oswald
thought he had penetrated a pro-Castro plot to kill the President.
But, in reality, he was mixed up with anti-Castro Cubans who were
posing as pro-Castro Cubans, and who were involving him in this
plot to kill the President. He said that he got a very negative
reaction from Oswald; kind of like: Oh, yeah? That's interesting;
and a don't-call-me-I'll-call-you type of attitude.

Now, what's interesting here is that this gets into the whole
issue of: Was the Oswald in New Orleans and the Oswald in Dallas
-- was this the real Lee Harvey Oswald?  And it gets into a bizarre
series of situations. But there is plenty of evidence to suggest
that the Oswald in New Orleans in the summer of `63 and in Dallas
later that fall was NOT the same Oswald who entered the Marines.
And if that's the CASE -- assuming that that may be true -- this
explains the whole situation with Nagle and Oswald. 

Nagle is very circuitously trying to warn Oswald, believing that
this is the same guy he knew in Japan, and that he would recognize
him and realize that he was getting the information from U.S.
intelligence.  And yet, if it was NOT the same Oswald -- and there
is MUCH evidence to suggest that this is so -- then Oswald in New
Orleans didn't recognize Nagle, didn't know who he was, and only
perhaps knew him as a KGB officer, and therefore, would be very
hesitant to believe him or to act on his information.

So that's the Nagle story, and I think it pretty well pinpoints
the role of Oswald. Oswald, as his mother and his wife had both
publicly stated, was a U.S. Government agent. He was posing as a
pro-Castroite and as a pro-Communist to infiltrate groups that he
felt were pro-Communist groups. In this instance, I think he had
been picked up by one of the more violent anti-Castro groups who
played him along and helped set him up as the "patsy"
in the assassination.
                      (to be continued)
*   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *   *

      If you agree that this story deserves broad public attention, please
      help to disseminate it by posting it to other bulletin boards,
      and by posting hardcopies in public places, both on and off campus. 
      As evidence accrues concerning the corporate mass-media's thirty-year
      cover-up of the corporate CIA's coup d'etat against the People of 
      the United States, the need for citizen reportage becomes
      ever more striking.

         John DiNardo


 
 
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From: abw@natchez.bu.edu (Al Wesolowsky)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy.jfk
Subject: Re: Oswald/Lovelady controversy
Keywords: Altgen photograph
Message-ID: <104773@bu.edu>
Date: 13 Dec 92 03:34:59 GMT
References: <1992Dec10.134442.28469@engage.pko.dec.com> <1992Dec12.063951.21159@u.washington.edu>
Sender: news@bu.edu
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In article <1992Dec12.063951.21159@u.washington.edu> twarner@hardy.u.washington.edu (Tom Warner) writes:

>What book has a good copy of the Altgens photo?
>
>I wonder if it's still possible to buy a print from the AP.

Sure is. I purchased one last Spring. The print is, as far as I can
tell, uncropped, but is at least a 2nd-genration print, maybe 3rd. Not
nearly as sharp as I expected. If there is interest I will dig out the
address, etc. for ordering. It wasn't cheap, either, ca. $60.00, but I
think it's worth it.

You actually don't order it from AP, but from an archival service with a
different phone number.

                            ---Al

-- 
Al B. Wesolowsky    Boston     o "En Cee Cee One Seven Oh One.... 
abw@crsa.bu.edu   University   o  No bloody 'A', 'B', 'C', or 'D'." 
abw@acs.bu.edu                 o                          M. Scott
 
 
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From: 6489mcadamsj@vms.csd.mu.edu (John McAdams)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy.jfk
Subject: Re: LHO MYSTERY ID
Date: 15 Dec 1992 02:36:06 GMT
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References: <009648BE.FB3F1580@vms.csd.mu.edu> <1992Dec7.015050.8875@eskimo.com> <00964CB5.550B64C0@vms.csd.mu.edu>,<1992Dec14.015032.17644@eskimo.com>
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In article <1992Dec14.015032.17644@eskimo.com>, wix@eskimo.com (Dennis Wicks) writes:

>Please note that all this is speculation on my part, but also a
>possible explanation for some of the things that happened.  If
>Oswald were indeed a "patsy" and he was trying to escape, perhaps
>he was doing something, going somewhere, other than what had been
>arranged.  If this were the case, then the conspirators might
>have felt that enlisting the aid of the Dallas PD to locate LHO
>and pin him down would be preferable to losing him completely and
>trying to find him before he let the cat out of the bag.

It seems to me that he would be less likely to "spill the beans" when "on the
lamb" than in custody.  Remember, The Conspiracy knew who it was looking for. 
Most conspiracy theorists (including you?) don't believe the Dallas Police knew
who they were looking for until the Conspiracy told them.

And how did The Conspiracy know so quickly that it had to have the Dallas Police
nab Oswald?  

Further, do you believe that this conspiracy was so sloppy that one of the main
characters would just break with the script?  Doesn't sound like the invincible
cabal that conspiracy theorists believe in.

>>
>>Then how did he happen to get planted at the School Book Depository?  Kennedy's
>>actual route wasn't known until a couple of days before the assasination.  How
>>did The Conspiracy know they needed someone working in that precise building? 
>>Or are you saying that The Conspiracy arranged for Kennedy to drive by?
>>
>Again, speculation, but it is possible that LHO wasn't the only
>person planted at various places around Dallas.  He just happened
>to be the one they used.  In most cities there are only a few
>"parade routes" because of problems with traffic control, public
>access, emergency vehicle routes, and other considerations.  So
>once the visit to Dallas was firm there were probably only a few
>possibilities that had to be covered.  And, it is possible that
>someone connected to the conspiracy could have influenced the
>choice of routes so that the one used was one they had covered.
>
But Oswald was working at the SBD before the visit to Dallas was firm.  And do
you really believe that The Conspiracy had large group of "patsies" in place
all around Dallas, so that one would be waiting along any route JFK took?

Do you REALLY believe that?

>I have a few related questions.  I haven't seen them discussed
>here recently, and if they were covered in the media at the time
>I have forgotten them.
>
>- Was it usual practice for prisoners to be transferred as LHO
>was at the time of his murder?
>
>- How did the press learn of the transfer?  Especially the time
>of the transfer?
>
>- More importantly, how did Jack Ruby learn about it?
>
>- Why was security so lax that nearly everybody and their dog was
>there to observe the transfer?
>

If you believe that any of this is evidence of conspiracy, you need to think of
the level of normal human incompetence.  Remember, the Dallas Police simply
never had a case like this before.  The NATION had not had a case like this
before.  (In Lincoln's time, for example, the media were far less numerous and
aggressive.)

Do you really believe the Dallas Police were so competent that they couldn't
screw up a case like this?

.John


 
 
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Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Monday, 14 Dec 1992 22:16:37 CST
From: <U54778@uicvm.uic.edu>
Message-ID: <92349.221637U54778@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy.jfk
Subject: Re: Oswald/Lovelady controversy
References: <1992Dec10.134442.28469@engage.pko.dec.com>
 <1992Dec12.063951.21159@u.washington.edu> <104773@bu.edu>
Lines: 8

The clearest and most full version of the Altgen's photo I have come
across is found in Weisberg's first Whitewash book.  You should be able to
find this in the library.

ALAN ROGERS  **** U54778@UICVM.UIC.EDU * I speak only for myself as a *
VMKRAFT INC.  708-675-8615             * citizen of the UNIVERSE, not *
                                       * as an employee of Vmkraft nor*
                                       * as a user of U of I Services.*
 
 




Post: 3628 of 3631
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Organization: University of Illinois at Chicago
Date: Monday, 14 Dec 1992 22:26:07 CST
From: <U54778@uicvm.uic.edu>
Message-ID: <92349.222607U54778@uicvm.uic.edu>
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy.jfk
Subject: Re: LHO MYSTERY ID
References: <009648BE.FB3F1580@vms.csd.mu.edu>
 <1992Dec7.015050.8875@eskimo.com>
 <00964CB5.550B64C0@vms.csd.mu.edu>,<1992Dec14.015032.17644@eskimo.com>
 <00965178.42A91120@vms.csd.mu.edu>
Lines: 41

In article <00965178.42A91120@vms.csd.mu.edu>, 6489mcadamsj@vms.csd.mu.edu (John
McAdams) says:
>
>In article <1992Dec14.015032.17644@eskimo.com>, wix@eskimo.com (Dennis Wicks)
>writes:
>>>Then how did he happen to get planted at the School Book Depository?
 more  
      
>Kennedy's
>>>actual route wasn't known until a couple of days before the assasination.   w
>Ho
>>>did The Conspiracy know they needed someone working in that precise
>building?
>>>Or are you saying that The Conspiracy arranged for Kennedy to drive by?
>>>
>>Again, speculation, but it is possible that LHO wasn't the only
>>person planted at various places around Dallas.  He just happened
>>to be the one they used.  In most cities there are only a few
>>"parade routes" because of problems with traffic control, public
>>access, emergency vehicle routes, and other considerations.  So
>>once the visit to Dallas was firm there were probably only a few
>>possibilities that had to be covered.  And, it is possible that
>>someone connected to the conspiracy could have influenced the
>>choice of routes so that the one used was one they had covered.
>>
>But Oswald was working at the SBD before the visit to Dallas was firm.  And do
>you really believe that The Conspiracy had large group of "patsies" in place
>all around Dallas, so that one would be waiting along any route JFK took?
 more  
      
>
>Do you REALLY believe that?
>
Let me suggest that there was no need to have numerous patsies planted in
Dallas.  An additional setup at the convention center where the motorcade
would evitably end was all that would be needed in addition to Dealey Plaza.
There is some evidence dug up by researchers that point to a reason for
such a poor showing of protection at Dealey Plaza was because they had
reasons to believe that something was planned for the convention center,
and therefore put the lion's share of security there.

ALAN ROGERS  **** U54778@UICVM.UIC.EDU * I speak only for myself as a *
VMKRAFT INC.  708-675-8615             * citizen of the UNIVERSE, not *
                                       * as an employee of Vmkraft nor*
                                       * as a user of U of I Services.*

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Post: 3629 of 3631
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From: 6489mcadamsj@vms.csd.mu.edu (John McAdams)
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy.jfk
Subject: Re: LHO MYSTERY ID
Date: 15 Dec 1992 19:29:39 GMT
Organization: Marquette University - Computer Services
Lines: 28
Message-ID: <00965205.DF3F9A80@vms.csd.mu.edu>
References: <009648BE.FB3F1580@vms.csd.mu.edu> <1992Dec7.015050.8875@eskimo.com> <00964CB5.550B64C0@vms.csd.mu.edu>,<1992Dec14.015032.17644@eskimo.com> <00965178.42A91120@vms.csd.mu.edu>,<92349.222607U54778@uicvm.uic.edu>
Reply-To: 6489mcadamsj@vms.csd.mu.edu
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In article <92349.222607U54778@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U54778@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:

>Let me suggest that there was no need to have numerous patsies planted in
>Dallas.  An additional setup at the convention center where the motorcade
>would evitably end was all that would be needed in addition to Dealey Plaza.
>There is some evidence dug up by researchers that point to a reason for
 more  
      
>such a poor showing of protection at Dealey Plaza was because they had
>reasons to believe that something was planned for the convention center,
>and therefore put the lion's share of security there.
>
OK, the Convention Center was a logical place.  But if The Conspiracy was going
to set up in *additional* places, why *just* Dealey Plaza?

But why set up in additional places at all?  Every additional site requires the
recruitment of additional people.  Remember, conspiracy theorists believe that
Oswald was killed because The Conspiracy believed he would "spill the beans." 
Are you saying that other people like Oswald (all potential "bean spillers")
had been recruited?

And why Dallas?  Remember, if your line of logic is correct, Oswald had to have
been put in place months before Kennedy came to Dallas.  Are you saying that
The Conspiracy believed that Kennedy would *eventually* come to Dallas, and
thus had the assassination planned when he came?  Or did they have lots of
people like Oswald (whether as co-conspirators or patsies) set up in cities all
over the nation?


 more  
      
.John

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Post: 3630 of 3631
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy.jfk
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From: twarner@hardy.u.washington.edu (Tom Warner)
Subject: Re: Oswald/Lovelady controversy
Message-ID: <1992Dec15.195216.16516@u.washington.edu>
Sender: news@u.washington.edu (USENET News System)
Organization: University of Washington
References: <1992Dec10.134442.28469@engage.pko.dec.com> <schuck.724093503@sfu.ca> <11DEC199213294014@zeus.tamu.edu> <1992Dec14.131112.1999@engage.pko.dec.com> <14DEC199211384190@zeus.tamu.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 19:52:16 GMT
Lines: 8

ajs9462@zeus.tamu.edu (SIMON, ANTHONY JOE) writes:

>     4) The fact the shirt color Oswald is closer to Oswald's shirt color in
>a mug shot taken later Nov. 22 does not make that Oswald either. Oswald was
>supposedly to have returned to his boarding house where he changed shirts.

 more  
      
Where did you get this info? I've never read that he changed shirts.


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Post: 3631 of 3631
Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy.jfk
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From: schuck@fraser.sfu.ca (Bruce Jonathan Schuck)
Subject: Re: LHO MYSTERY ID
Message-ID: <schuck.724455877@sfu.ca>
Sender: news@sfu.ca
Reply-To: Bruce_Schuck@sfu.ca
Organization: Simon Fraser University, Burnaby, B.C., Canada
References: <009648BE.FB3F1580@vms.csd.mu.edu> <1992Dec7.015050.8875@eskimo.com> <00964CB5.550B64C0@vms.csd.mu.edu>,<1992Dec14.015032.17644@eskimo.com> <00965178.42A91120@vms.csd.mu.edu>,<92349.222607U54778@uicvm.uic.edu> <00965205.DF3F9A80@vms.csd.mu.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1992 21:44:37 GMT
Lines: 40

6489mcadamsj@vms.csd.mu.edu (John McAdams) writes:

>In article <92349.222607U54778@uicvm.uic.edu>, <U54778@uicvm.uic.edu> writes:

 more  
      
>>Let me suggest that there was no need to have numerous patsies planted in
>>Dallas.  An additional setup at the convention center where the motorcade
>>would evitably end was all that would be needed in addition to Dealey Plaza.
>>There is some evidence dug up by researchers that point to a reason for
>>such a poor showing of protection at Dealey Plaza was because they had
>>reasons to believe that something was planned for the convention center,
>>and therefore put the lion's share of security there.
>>
>OK, the Convention Center was a logical place.  But if The Conspiracy was going
>to set up in *additional* places, why *just* Dealey Plaza?

As I posted earlier, Dealey Plaza was the traditional route for
motorcades. Connally told the HSCA that *every* motorcade went
through Dealey Plaza.

>But why set up in additional places at all?  Every additional site requires the
>recruitment of additional people.  Remember, conspiracy theorists believe that
>Oswald was killed because The Conspiracy believed he would "spill the beans." 
>Are you saying that other people like Oswald (all potential "bean spillers")
 more  
      
>had been recruited?

>And why Dallas?  Remember, if your line of logic is correct, Oswald had to have
>been put in place months before Kennedy came to Dallas.  Are you saying that
>The Conspiracy believed that Kennedy would *eventually* come to Dallas, and
>thus had the assassination planned when he came?  Or did they have lots of
>people like Oswald (whether as co-conspirators or patsies) set up in cities all
>over the nation?

The previous hit site was probably Miami. The motorcade was cancelled
in Miami for security reasons and JFK took a helicopter to his speaking
site. The 'patsy' in Miami probably survived, although it might be
interesting to check for suspicious deaths in Miami just after the JFK
visit to look for Oswald-like people who died mysteriously.




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